I haven’t linked to this very smart and politically incorrect site for quite a while. I suggest that those who don’t think much about the damage our lack of selectivity in immigration may bring take a tour of the site. If genetics, IQ, ability and innovativeness are kept off the table for discussion about who we will be in the future, then perhaps we’re too dumb already to keep this republic.
I’m not going to shy away from posting about quality. Even if our Latino invaders were somehow able to bring their mean abilities up to those of Geraldo Rivera, we’d still have a mass of mal-assimilated fifth columnists, not Americans. But we don’t have to worry about legions of Riveras at all. We do, however, have to worry about legions of third-generation Latino gangbangers:
Gene Expression: Immigration Reform
(This is a chart from the post. It graphically displays the sort of skills and abilities of those we import and the illegal aliens we should be getting rid of…)
Next up, one of the blogs linked from the post above:
The trouble is that you need a lot more education to compete in today’s economy than you did in the economy of 1887 or 1921, which is why Mexican-Americans can make bigger strides than did, say, Italian-Americans in the 19th century, and still find themselves further behind, in socioeconomic terms, than that earlier generation did. Which explains, in turn, why so many second and third-generation Mexican-Americans are growing frustrated with the slow pace of socioeconomic progress and assimilating downward, toward underclass rather than middle-class norms. Thus crime rates, while low for new immigrants, are high for their children and grandchildren; thus, too, the use of welfare programs remains nearly as high in the second Mexican-American generation as in the first.
I’ll close this post with a link to another site I’ve neglected of late. Breaking All The Rules is a very complex and hard to fathom site at times, but it is full of wonderful gems of truth and intellect. It’s worth a bookmark and a periodic visit:
Different human ethnic groups and races have been separated for thousands of years. During this period, they have evolved some genetic distinctiveness.But, Salter notes, measuring these differences is now a straightforward process, thanks to the work of researchers like Luigi Cavalli-Sforza whose book The History and Geography of Human Genes documents the genetic distances between human groups.
It turns out that the distances between human populations correspond approximately to what a reasonably well-informed historian or demographer or tourist would expect. For instance, Scandinavians have greater overlap of genetic interests with other Scandinavians than other Europeans. Europeans have a greater genetic interest in other Europeans than in Africans.
In fact, on average, people are as closely related to other members of their ethnic group, versus the rest of the world, as they are closely related to their grandchildren, versus the rest of their ethnic group.
Salter suggests we think of it this way: citing authors like Garret Hardin and E. O. Wilson, he argues that we can’t just keep on expanding our numbers and usage of resources indefinitely. If immigrants contribute to the economy in ways that the native population cannot, the national carrying capacity is raised. But if they are a drain on resources or even of average productivity, they must take the place of potential native-born in the ultimate total population. It’s a zero-sum game.
Let’s suppose that immigrants have equal capacities to the native born. Then if 10,000 Danes emigrate to England and ultimately substitute for 10,000 English natives, the average Englishman loses the genetic equivalent of 167 children (or siblings) in the ultimate total population, because of the close genetic relationship between Denmark and England This is not a great loss.
However, if 10,000 Bantu emigrate to England and substitute for 10,000 English natives, the average Englishman loses the genetic equivalent of 10,854 children (or siblings).
This is the “rubbing elbows“ issue I’ve written about here before. We need to interject in this debate over immigration the ancient sociological factors involved.
Immigration has been a success for this nation for only one reason: Historically, we have only allowed those to come who have ancestors that our ancestors knew - often in the biblical sense - for thousands of years. Before Teddy Kennedy started screwing this nation in 1965 for being mean to some of his ancestors, those who came here weren’t different enough from us to actually displace us.
Now they are. Not getting rid of them, even harshly if necessary, will represent the stupidest thing a nation has even done to itself in all of recorded history. If this nation ever fails, I guarantee that history will record its demise as being caused by the importation of incompatibles.
Call me whatever names you like over this contention. But intelligently try to prove me wrong when you do it. I dare you.
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American History, Assimilation, Conservatism, Culture, Diversity, Immigration, Multiculturalism, Political Correctness
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28 responses so far ↓
1 razib // Jun 9, 2007 at 4:18 pm
just to be accurate, geraldo rivera’s mother is jewish. so he isn’t typical as far as latinos go (he is also of puerto rican heritage on his father’s side).
2 azresistance // Jun 10, 2007 at 1:38 am
Excellent post KD. This is an overlooked addition to the “dumbing down” of America problem.
Razib, thank you for your insights on immigration reform. You do indeed have much to add to the discussion.
3 Katie's Dad // Jun 10, 2007 at 12:09 pm
Thanks razib. Your piece at Gene Expression is excellent and moving.
I noted with a lot of hope that you reminded us that you did abjure allegiance to your birth nation when you swore our oath. I only wish it were possible to make sure that all those who take the oath have the intent to be as loyal to it as you appear to be.
4 Deena Flinchum // Jun 10, 2007 at 12:48 pm
Don’t know where it first came from, but I first read it in the now gone “Public Interest”. If you want to avoid dire poverty, you must do 3 things: 1- Complete HS. IMO you need more than that now but at least complete HS. 2- Don’t have children until you are at least in your 20’s, are settled, married, and can afford them. 3- Get a job and keep it. You can’t make your way up the ladder if you aren’t at least on the bottom rung.
Most Mexican immigrants fail miserably on the first two, which makes it less likely that they’ll succeed even if they do the last one.
In the mid-60’s just before we baby boomers started graduating HS, the percentage of US citizens with HS diplomas was just a bit over 50%. That is where most Mexican immigrants are now.
5 Guessedworker // Jun 11, 2007 at 1:49 am
Frank Salters On Genetic Interests was attacked by GNXP’s David B, his central thrust being that genetic interests were “mystical”.
GNXP is a blog representing the interestof relatively high Indians. Occasional readers of Sepia Mutiny see his preference regularly on display, and it isn’t just for high IQers regardless of ethnicity.
I don’t know Douthat. The principle proponent of Salterism blogs with me at MR.
6 Katie's Dad // Jun 11, 2007 at 12:29 pm
Guessedworker,
Thanks for commenting. You make important points. I’m very impressed by your site after spending just a few minutes browsing it. I’ll return often and when I have more time to digest the well-thought-out concepts you posit there.
Right from the start, I know I’ll be enlightened with each visit. Wow!
7 Dee // Jul 21, 2007 at 10:54 pm
KD, I disagree with your assumptions and conclusions of the census charts illustrated on your blog. If you study the history of immigration to our USA, you will see the track record of the US importing manual laborers from Mexico and other Latin countries. When we have labor shortages we see the ebb. When we have surpluses or periods of xenophobis, we see programs put in place like “Operation Wetback” in the 50´s. Please don´t pull a John Tanton on us and say Hispanics are uneducatable.
The answer is education. If you want to learn more about the Mexican American experience, come visit my blog - http://immigrationmexicanamerican.blogspot.com/
8 Katie's Dad // Jul 22, 2007 at 12:08 am
Dee,
As far as your disagreement about my posting and commenting about materials at another website that I found interesting, what part of “the average IQ for the entire nation of Mexico is 87″ do you not understand? Just because you may represent a statistical outlier, cumulative data is what it is; of course, your raising strawman objections to it does raise a question regarding how much of an outlier you actually are.
Bluntly, if you take a nation that has an average IQ of 100 and over the course of two generations you assure that a whole new fifth (or quarter) of the population is added, bringing with it an average IQ of less than 90 - knowing that IQs do mostly remain Flynn-effect consistent across generations - how have you made it better?
That said, I never indicated Hispanics are ineducable. I pointed out that they are statistically less intelligent using a common gauge of intelligence. Other indicators such as SAT scores seem to validate the IQ numbers. Of course Hispanics can be educated. But, in other posts I have pointed out that as a general rule most of the source nation-cultures and tribes from which America’s Hispanic residents have come have an unusual level of antipathy for education. I have also questioned the wisdom of the importation of any significant numbers of people whose source cultures have no traditional or ancestral ties to Western Civilization. This nation has never proved capable of assimilating people whose lineages have differed too greatly. It did not assimilate the Chinese who came to build railroads. It did not assimilate the Braceros. It has only successfully assimilated Brits, Germans, French, Scandinavians and (to a slightly lesser extent) Italians.
The key commonality between all of these nations is that their cultures originated in the tribes and clans that had settled in Western Europe over the past couple hundred generations. The farther away from the British homeland the source culture of an immigrant Diaspora originates, the less likely it is that complete assimilation can occur. This all corresponds with the percentage of shared alleles… but based on your misapprehension of my post, I really don’t think you’d even come close to understanding that argument.
Please understand and take to heart that I really have less than zero interest in the “Mexican-American experience.” I’m fed up with absurd hyphenated experiences of any sort. If I had any interest in hearing the concerns of poorly Americanized American citizens, I would not have packed up and moved my family out of South Florida four years ago.
I consider anyone a friend if they have Morris Dees for an enemy. So, I’ll happily pull a John Tanton if I choose. And for good measure, I’ll pull a Sam Huntington a Robert Locke and Sam Francis for good measure.
Your prose may be somewhat crisp, your positions may be expressed in a heartfelt manner and your intentions may be somewhat honorable, but in reviewing your words what I see is a third-generation American who has little if any veneration for my ancestors. And I think that sucks. It just serves to remind me that if the Johnson-Reed Act was still the law of the land, we would not need to have this national dialog.
You probably don’t see it, but your blog simply seethes with quasi-American Mexitude. You insist on being able to cling to your heritage. But after reading some of your work, I don’t think it’s within you to have any respect for those of us who wish to follow the heritage and prescriptions handed down by our American ancestors. You’re too wrapped up in your own ethnocentricities to notice that your attitude reveals them quite clearly.
Let me parse some of the drivel you serve up on your blog:
They haven’t made a violin small enough for me to play the song I’d like to play upon reading this unoriginal tripe. It doesn’t differ one bit from stories I heard while living in Miami, and they were usually followed with some sort of reference to how “before we got here, Miami was NOTHING!” So Cry me a river. You write as if discrimination is somehow a one-way street. It’s a typical delusion.
While I do think it’s laudable your father insisted you speak unaccented english and that you get educated, it’s pretty clear that you’ve spent too much time immersed in pop culture and have very little if any attachment to American tradition… except for that which you regale and insist upon helping others impose upon this nation. As I once wrote, pop culture is ephemeral - real culture is that which endures. Attachment to the former cannot result in assimilation, only the latter may.
Did you ever stop to think that in their desire for you not to “disrupt their lives” they were being mindful of their heritage? Did it ever cross a single synapse that they believed they were bettering your lot in life by giving you the opportunity to make some money so that things would be better when you went back to where you came from? Considering that you now live in Texas, which has always been a sort of natural fringe between cultures, I’d like to know if you went there because you feel more comfortable. After all, human nature drives us to seek such spaces and places. I’d just like to keep as many of them as possible here in America so that my daughter, and any other children my wife and I may have, will have as many similar places of cultural comfort as possible. I’d just rather my descendants live in a culture in which it is acceptable for them to become stewards of the traditions, heritage and handed down legacies that my parents gave to me.
It appears you suffer from a severe case of selective cognition. There are many of us… I’ll go so far as to say even most of us who study the issue and oppose mass immigration… who insist that the three keys to solving the illegal immigration crisis: 1) border security, 2) attrition through interior enforcement, and 3)harsh punishments for those who employ illegal aliens. Further, if you’ve really been doing the amount of research you claim, you should be well aware that we don’t trust the Department of Homeland Security, President Bush, Julie Myers or Michael Chertoff about anything. And that goes double when it comes to the pathetically insufficient dog and pony shows they’ve been putting on in pretense of “being serious about enforcement.”
Don’t try to tell me you’re no idea how offensive it is to be referred to as “Anglo.” In counter-example: I once dated a nice WASP girl who wished she was a Spic, but that wasn’t a proper way to phrase it. So, if you want to discuss “pet peeves,” I have a problem with ethnocentric Hispanic bitches coming on my site to lecture me.
Yeah, I can’t wait to read your sorry crap about why a nation does not have a right to have, or should not have, an official language. I suggest strongly that you read Washington’s Farewell Address, Federalist Paper Number Two, and Thomas Jefferson’s Notes on Virginia-Query Eight before you make an ass of yourself again.
As far as your misunderstanding of our intent regarding the 14th Amendment, our desire is to have Congress do its job. The 14th Amendment was specifically crafted to undo the Dred Scott decision. Consistently throughout the floor debate over the language that eventually passed, its framers insisted that it would not apply to aliens or to the children of aliens. Our intent is to have Congress use the authority designated to it under Section 5 “to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.” Congress is remiss in never having enacted legislation to set forth in corresponding statute the full, complete and accurate intent as expressed in myriad passages of floor debate over the amendment. The loophole for anchor babies needs to be closed. Period.
Please. Don’t flatter yourself. To get back around to your initial disagreement with me, Ann Coulter has an IQ somewhere in the neighborhood of 150 or higher. If I had to guess, I’d say you’re at least 55 to 60 points shy of that. Just about where Geraldo Rivera is…
9 Dee // Jul 22, 2007 at 10:53 am
You provided me your feedback about my blog. Now I will provide my response to yours. It is obvious you like to hear yourself talk and read your own blogs. You are your biggest fan. Does Katie or your wife ever get a word in edge-wise?
The reason Northern European´s have the same experience is because they came in the front door and were welcomed. If you bother to study history, you know Mexican migrants were brought in by corporations and farm bureaus to do the “work Americans won´t do” and then were sent home via xenophobic, nativist movements like Eisenhauer´s Operation Wetback.
You obviously do not understand poverty. I´m sure you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth and your mother never disciplined you. I´m sure you were mommie´s little darling and she allowed you to use your profane language and batter the help. No wonder you keep using the B word every chance you get.
Did it ever occur to you that all people are created equal? Did the words of the Declaration of Independence not sink in with you?
In regards to your “we don´t trust…” comment about Employer Sanctions and your mistrust of the Bush Administration, what are you doing about it except bloviating on your own blog.
I will take your advice and write about my stance on “Official English” vs “English as our National Language.” I am absolutely positive my blog will stick in your craw!! I will also write one on your 14th Amendment wish which will never, ever come true. (So sad for you!)
Regarding the Ann Coulter quote, it was said about me, I certainly would not compare myself to him or his Adam´s apple!! Regarding my IQ, if it makes you feel better about yourself to believe that I or any Hispanic has a lower IQ than you do, than think what you want. Who cares. What have you achieved?
Well, KD. You are right on one account. Your diatribes do resemble Tanton´s and you are a pompous ass, but then, you already know this. I hope you are happy in the Aryan Nation of Idaho. I hope your maid irons your white hood with enough starch for you.
Take Care Sweetie.
Xxx ooo,
Dee
10 Katie's Dad // Jul 22, 2007 at 2:01 pm
Since you are obviously so “well studied” on all the issues pertaining to immigration, I’d love to see some empirical evidence to back up this absurdity. I don’t think I need to worry about your having any form of proof, for your brand of ethnocentricity is based mostly on bluster and insecurity. I, on the other hand, based my original post on the conclusions of others who actually did research the matter. All you have are fairy tales told you by mommy, who obviously remained clueless about Americanism throughout her life.
Sweetie, I have been studying history for my entire life. What I also have, and you so obviously lack, are stories of heritage that have been handed down through the generations for 400 years since my first ancestor set foot on this continent. Chances are, you cannot name even one great-great-grandparent. I can name several.
Also, as far as this matter of mass immigration/unconscionable invasion is concerned, I had my epiphany in 1990 that people who think like you are a threat to the future of this nation; they remain ignorant that the notion of a “multicultural nation” is an oxymoron. And if you bothered to ever try and understand the true nature, the root of the word “nation,” you might actually catch on to the poisonous absurdity of your love for diversity. So, I’ve been researching and debating matters relating to immigration for 17 years while you apparently got your panties in a wad over it just a few months ago. While I provided links to good source material, I have zero expectation that you will read what George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, John Jay, Robert Locke or Sam Francis had to say about the seminal nature of history and Americanism. You don’t respect them.
No, actually I was not. My father was just shy of 60, and disabled, when I was born. What wealth he had accumulated was spent keeping him alive. We moved from our longtime home in the Midwest to Florida at the recommendation of his doctors and my mother entered the workforce for the first time in her life at 43. Dad died when I was seven. The only “riches” I got from him came from the fact that he took care of me while my mom worked and shared with me the stories, the handed down legacies, that he had been careful to steward for me just as his parents had cared for them on his behalf. In an odd quirk, thanks to my being the youngest son of the youngest son of the youngest son, I’m only 12 generations removed from my ancestors who arrived here in the early 1600s. I’m only five generations removed from the Revolutionary War Captain who was George Washington’s Masonic Lodge brother, long-time neighbor and good friend. I wouldn’t trade the heritage wealth my father entrusted me for any amount of money, and I’ll be damned if I ever sit idly by while insipid fools like you operate as termites upon the foundation I am charged with keeping whole. Understand?
As for my mother, she became disabled right after I graduated from high school. I took care of her for a year and, when she was well enough, I then went off to college. During my last semester at the university, she had a horrible accident and was burned very severely. I managed to get through the semester and graduate while juggling this crisis from 400 miles away. The day of my commencement, I skipped out so that I could take her home from the hospital burn unit. For six months she lived in constant agony, unable to do much for herself or ever venture outside again. She always liked to talk about her heritage and, toward the end, she came to the realization of how much it paralleled that of my father’s family history.
When I read tripe like the stuff you post to your blog, it strikes me how much your vile assertions would offend her. It was a blessing when she died. It is an even greater blessing that she is not here to witness what people like you are trying to do to her nation.
Please, show me where it says that because we’re all created equal we must forego the obligations we have to our ancestors and to our descendants.
I do have to thank you for reminding me about why I started to fight against mass immigration 17 years ago. If you are so well-equipped to argue about immigration, chew on this: history is repeating itself. The last time our citizenry was awakened like it is today to the threats posed by mass immigration was about 1920. The good thing for people like me in saying this is that we can stand in near 100% certainty that people like you don’t have a clue about what we mean.
11 Dee // Jul 22, 2007 at 2:40 pm
Well Daddy, I see you have a healthy sense of humor, are a master of assumptions and have a spirit for one up-manship. Good for you.
Of course I study history. Currently, I am reading “Al Norte, Agricultural Workers in the Great Lakes Region, 1917 – 1970.” I am also reading “Anglos and Mexicans in the Making of Texas, 1836 – 1986.” I doubt you have read them. I am sure you read your little history books full of the glory of Manifest Destiny and the justification of territorial acquisitions.
You jump to conclusions when you say I do not know my own ancestors. Of course I know them. I have documented my family history back to their arrival from Spain in the 1500´s through to my great grandfather´s land grant in Texas territory in the 1800´s through to the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo and to current times when I taped an oral history my mother provided which I have stored now on DVD.
I will give you credit for caring for your mother while she was ill. Anyone who loves and cares for his mother so endearingly has some redeeming qualities, although apparently not many more.
Your xenophobia and racism are obvious in your writings. I am sure your audience was not aware of them until now.
You are right that xenophobia raised its ugly head in the 1920´s. The Immigration Act of 1924, which included the National Origins Act, Asian Exclusion Act and the Johnson-Reed Act targeted southern and eastern European immigrants and the rate of legal immigrants from those countries were limited. The Anglos hated the Germans. They were so afraid they were taking over. They hated the Asians too. That was why they drove to exclude them in these acts.
For people like you, these laws “shot you in the foot.” Didn´t you notice. These laws did nothing to reduce the numbers coming in from the south. Do you know why? Because the corporations and farm bureaus wanted the Mexican migrants working for them. They didn´t want the “intrusive” Germans here. They wanted the Mexicans because they were “docile and easy to control.” They brought them here to work and drove them off when the work was finished.
Don´t forget your other great moment in History, Eisenhauer´s “Operation Wetback” in the 1950s.
One thing I am curious about Daddy. What was it that set you so against minorities in this country? Did a beautiful senorita break your heart? Did a Hispanic Gaucho steal a lovely lady from you? What drove you over the edge?
Take Care Sweetie,
Xxx ooo
Dee
12 Dee // Jul 22, 2007 at 4:33 pm
BTW Sweetie,
I do like this discussion.
You are smart. You are savvy. You are quick.
I dare you to put me on your Blogroll!!
Let´s do this again!!
See if you can beat me next time!!
13 Katie's Dad // Jul 22, 2007 at 4:48 pm
It doesn’t surprise me that your primary reading materials are the product of ethnocentric Hispanic academicians with revisionist notions and humongous chips on their shoulders. It begs the question: When you think about the people who started this nation, in your mind are they “our founding fathers,” or, are they “their founding fathers?”
My suspicion is that for you it is the latter, and I’m not inclined to believe your protestations to the contrary. Considering that you have no response to my inquiries and recommendations regarding the study of George Washington’s Farewell Address, Federalist Paper Number Two and Jefferson’s Notes on Virginia Query Eight, I feel pretty secure in my inclination.
I think it’s great that you know about your ancestors. But I think it’s a shame that this nation currently has in Diaspora so many ineligible for membership in Sons of the American Revolution. As for your insistence that I am fueled by xenophobia and racism, I find it laughable that you can maintain this position while being such a rabidly ethnocentric shill yourself. If society ever breaks down thanks to multiculturalism’s cancerous growth, and it may well come to that soon, then it will be people like you whose loyalty should come into question first.
As for as your take on immigration reforms of the 1920s, how do you reconcile your disdain for those acts with the normal desire and historical pattern of every nation’s citizen-majority to maintain its traditions, its legacies, its language and its unrevised history so that it’s next generations - its children - have a sense of cohesive identification and continuity? After all, your preference is to impose Mexifornication upon us all. I don’t care one bit that people like you get upset with the notion that I consider my stewardship obligations to be more important than you, your family or your descendants futures. My ancestors built and nurtured something that they gave to me and my family. They called in America. What you desire, if you are successful in attaining it, will not be American at all. It might still be called “America,” but it will not be something that my ancestors would recognize as being worthy of the name.
From my point of view, Operation Wetback was a smashing success. It stands as proof that we do not need to deport 20 million illegal aliens. We only need leaders committed to showing the rest of the world that we have an intent, and are willing to back it up, that our nation’s sovereignty is not negotiable. Operation Wetback proved that attrition is attainable.
Where you most completely misconstrue my intentions and desires is that I do not have antipathy for minorities, per se. But I do have disdain for any group, from anywhere, of any culture, who would come here in such numbers that they remain in Diaspora conveniently, disrespect our rule of law routinely, remain ignorant of our heritage intentionally and really only come here to get our stuff and, perhap, imbibe in pop culture. I’ve made it clear numerous times in the couple thousand posts I’ve made on this blog since 2002 that my awakening to this crisis came gradually after being exposed to numerous imposed sorts of arrogance while working in Miami and later living there. The place is a cesspool, and what was done to the people who laid the foundation for American society in the region is simply unconscionable act of neglect on the part of our government. When several hundred thousand people feel compelled to leave their hometowns, their businesses and sometimes even their greatest dreams behind because the people to whom they gave shelter turn out to be really crappy, endemically corrupt and arrogant guests, then they have a right to be pissed off.
I held out much longer than most of my friends from high school and college. It was only after Katie’s birth that I realized it would not be fair to her to make her grow up in that god-awful place when there were other options. My responsibility to her is to make sure that she is able to take care of her heritage, just as my parents expected me to do. I don’t give a flying flip how much it bothers people like you that I am determined to do so.
14 Dee // Jul 22, 2007 at 7:44 pm
If I were you, I would read the books I reference before passing judgement on them.
I´ve read Washington´s farewell address. You continue to refer to the archaic definition for nation and old writings that don´t apply today. We have evolved. We are in the 21st century. This is not the 1700 or 1800´s. I know you long for the days of your plantation and obedient darkies. Those days are long gone and they will never, ever return. Snap out of it and come back to reality. Oh, that´s right. You moved to the Aryan Nation.
I find it amazing you do not recognize your own xenophobia and racism. You don´t see the Chinese Labor Act or Operation Wetback as exclusionary, racist or xenophobic. You don´t recognize the exclusionary immigration policies of the past as advancing what you term as “Mexifornication.” You xenophobes brought this upon yourselves.
The reason times have changed is due to the Civil Rights Movement of the 1960´s. Having grown up in these times, you should know this.
The rate of Hispanics will not diminish. We are CITIZENS and our numbers are growing You cannot stop this. Your Northern European policies have brought us to where we are today. Now, with the accomplishments of the Civil Rights movement, we have learned we are, in fact, equal. What you don´t understand is, your side will not win. You are on your last stand. It is time for you to embrace multiculturalism or move to Idaho and build a wall around yourself. You may be able to live out your days in your exclusionary retreat. You might just make it.
Take Care My Friend,
Dee
15 Katie's Dad // Jul 23, 2007 at 4:38 pm
Blogroll you? Not a chance. Fisk you? absolutely
16 Dee // Jul 23, 2007 at 7:00 pm
If I inspired you again, think of what I can do for others. Don´t be afraid.
Just think. You could be the first bigshot to discover me.
17 Arizona Resistance // Jul 24, 2007 at 9:55 am
Well, she sure as hell is no “Ann Coulter” of ANY movement. KD, the only thing you “discovered” is just another wanna be wordsmith suffering from delusions of grandeur. She has hitched her wagon to a popular topic she feels she can personally relate to in the hopes she might ride it all the way to a book deal or a talk show interview. I’m sure you’re painfully aware this whole debate with you was her feeble attempt to use you as a stepping stone. She’s nothing more than a little talent popular topic whore, hoping for a big break. Give her a couple months with no results, and she’ll be off on something else. I doubt her sincerity in this topic.
I do enjoy reading you. I was hoping she would have been more of an interesting debate. Some of the liberals in the past have been more interesting and engaging. Nice job, none the less.
18 Dee // Jul 24, 2007 at 11:14 pm
Looks like Rev Al agrees with me!
Sharpton, a civil rights activist who has often railed against corporate America, went further in his support for a bill that would provide a path to legalization for many of the nation’s more than 12 million illegal immigrants. He denounced TV and radio shows that foster an “us against them” mentality.
“I want to say what a lot of people won’t say. The immigration debate is not simply about border security, it is a problem of America dealing with race,” Sharpton told the audience.
PS: AZ Resistance — and you sir, are no gentleman!!
19 Arizona Resistance // Jul 25, 2007 at 12:26 pm
KD, I’m sorry. I know I shouldn’t be so weak as to allow myself to be pulled into the fray with a blog troll. I have been fighting the impulse all morning and have obviously lost control of my better judgement.
Madam Troll,
Thank you for not mistaking me for a gentleman. There is nothing gentle about me. As a union boilermaker by trade, I take your weak attempt at insult as a compliment.
As an American fighting to retain a once great American culture, I see no need for pleasantries in battle either.
The only informative item you’ve presented is in your assigning relevance to Mr. Sharpton. I hesitate to refer to him as “Reverend”, on account that it still hasn’t been ascertained as to what congregation he is the clergyman of. None the less; America’s search is over! It appears we have found the ONE person left outside the white liberal media that still finds Mr. Sharpton relevant. I’m sure if you would let him know this, he would gladly reciprocate in kind and lend you relevance. Who knows, since Black America has labeled him as the snake oil salesman that he is, I’m sure he would willfully change his name to Alberto Sharptonero and invite you to appear with him the next time he starts dealing race cards like a Vegas gambler.
Of course, you would have to become quite skilled at fund raising. He does love those Giorgio Armani suits.
When you and Sharpton can put down your deck of race cards and talk about the assimilation of races into the AMERICAN culture, rather than the assimilation of America into Mexican, Islamic and other cultures… progress will be made.
I and others of like mind have no problem with peoples of ANY race legally immigrating to America. It’s one of the foundations that made this country great. All that is asked by the “antis’” As you like to call us, them, whoever the hell they are… Is that they assimilate to the American culture and live by it’s laws. Why people such as you think America should assimilate to accommodate the Latino or any other culture is beyond me. It does make one wonder who the “racists” really are.
KD, again, my apologies. Although I’m aware my words were wasted and nothing good will come of it; it was therapeutic for me to give her my opinion as unwanted as it was. I know that’s not how you “ignore” a blog troll. I promise I won’t allow myself to get hooked again.
20 Dee // Jul 25, 2007 at 7:39 pm
AZ Resistance,
I recognized you were not a gentleman immediately. I could sense, in every key you typed, that your emotions were overwhelming you. You are seething in red-faced anger. I am not a troll. I am an informed, intelligent, Hispanic American woman. In other words, your worst nightmare come true.
You seethe in anger in the fact that I can speak to you on a level playing field. All you could do ALL of your life could not and will not squelch my ability to speak to you as an equal.
Yes. I am equal. In fact, on an IQ scale, I far surpass you.
[EDITOR'S NOTE: Just for grins, I've run Dee's writing through a word-boiler that determines the the Flesch-Kincaid Grade Level at which the text was written. Nothing she's written has risen above third grade level. Make of it what you will, but considering most fully literate adults prefer their reading material to be at the eighth grade level or above (about like most newspapers), it makes her IQ claims dubious at best. And she likes to think she's the Latino Ann Coulter...sheesh!]
This information resonates in your left molar. It irritates your teeth just to know this. Your teeth grind at night just thinking that someone like me lives and breathes in America. I am an American.
I am a proud American.
I have lived and thrived here all of your life and you didn´t even know it.
Nothing, nothing you could ever do could stop me from thriving, thriving in education, knowledge, reading, studying and continually growing strong.
I am loyal to our Founding Fathers beliefs. Yes. That is right. OUR Founding Fathers. I claim them too.
Doesn´t this fact just stick in your craw. Doesn´t this gell in your multitude of anger. Seething, raging, angry you.
I survived. I am here. I lay claim to the beliefs of OUR Founding Fathers.
ALL PEOPLE ARE CREATED EQUAL.
And yet, you seethe!!
Xxx ooo
Your Friend,
Dee
Ps: come and debate me on MATT.org if you dare.
21 tweety // Jul 25, 2007 at 8:42 pm
I am also a member of MATT. Oh the things I could tell you KD, etal. But I think you are finding out for yourselves. It doesn’t take long, does it?
22 Michael Tams // Jul 25, 2007 at 8:48 pm
I’ve resisted commenting until now. Twice you have quoted the Declaration of Independence and revealed what an utter goof you are; I’m sorry, but that’s the only conclusion. The phrase in question has a very specific meaning - one you would understand if you were the student of history you claim to be - that is inconsistent with the way you are using it. This is a little embarrassing, for it reminds me of my 8 year old neighbor remarking on something he likes and saying it is “totally egregious.”
Nevertheless, in the interest of correcting your foolishness and perhaps - God willing - keeping you from quoting that section of the DoI again: the phrase that Jefferson used in the Declaration was debated to a large degree, but the language used was decided on because the founders largely thought that NO ONE WOULD BE STUPID ENOUGH TO MISCONSTRUE THE ACTUAL MEANING. Namely, that by saying “we hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal…” they meant (as they would follow with an extensive discussion of) that all people were created with equal rights, and among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. The founders weren’t fools, and understood that anyone who suggested that “All people are created equal” as you so eloquently misquote, might be a few fries short of a happy meal.
Again, I’m sorry for being so blunt, but that’s the ever-loving DECLARATION you’re butchering in the name of your ridiculous positions, and if you have any sense of decency, you’ll cork it with that clap-trap.
23 Arizona Resistance // Jul 25, 2007 at 10:29 pm
Ok…. I was hoping for a more intelligent response from someone who asserts an I.Q. of over 156.
Let me refresh your memory. The question was… Why must America assimilate to immigrant cultures rather than immigrants assimilating to the American culture?
I don’t recall questioning your citizenship. Are you that entranced in your self-imposed victimization? Or, are you just stuck on stupid.
The more I read your posts here and the pseudo victories you claim on your site, the more I’m convinced my first impression of you was right on the money.
24 Arizona Resistance // Jul 25, 2007 at 10:38 pm
Would someone please explain to her what a “troll” is. And then maybe, WHAT the American kernel is and not WHO the American kernel is. Her naivete is really starting to annoy me.
25 Arizona Resistance // Jul 25, 2007 at 10:50 pm
I can’t help but wonder which marketing firm you work for. In all seriousness, Al Sharpton really could use your “spin and sell” routine. If I were you, I’d keep sending him emails.
26 Arizona Resistance // Jul 26, 2007 at 12:11 am
KD,
I noticed something eerily familiar with this Dee visitor’s initial argument. Or, lack there of. I started doing a little flipping through the archives and found what was triggering my deja vu. It was one of your posts from just last May. http://americankernel.com/2007/05/more-arrogant-foreigners-weigh-in-on-what-america-should-be/
It’s as though Dee is or was trying to have the same debate that was had in May almost to the letter.
No wonder you tired of it so quickly. I should have caught that sooner.
27 Katie's Dad // Jul 26, 2007 at 1:03 am
Dee won’t be back. I decided I’d had enough after I pegged her as an habitual liar and saw that the pattern was starting to show up here. I first noticed her propensity to spin toward untruth over at her own blog. Apparently it’s her routine over at that MATT place, too. I have friends who will put up with mouth breathing morons, but I guess I’m just not as gracious when such trolls show up on my turf.
She’s not welcome here…there’s no reason to discern between how we should treat an illegal alien and someone who believes they have the right to impose alien traditions upon our culture.
Catapult, please…
28 Katie's Dad // Jul 26, 2007 at 11:34 am
AZ,
You’re absolutely right. This argument, which basically contends that there is and has never been a “unique American culture” is the wedge point. It crops up again and again in my discussions with Latinos. Curiously, even the most caustic American liberals won’t use the “we have no heritage” argument, even obliquely. Until recently, lots of Americans who inherently know better just let stuff like what Dee writes slide by unchallenged…or were politically corrected away from expressing reasonable opposition.
We’re seeing a change in that…and the stupidity-laced arrogance of people like Dee is responsible for a vast awakening by Americans of Heritage that there really is an intent to supplant the entire set of Western Civilization and American cultural goods in the name of the cultural Marxism of political correctness. In America, it comes primarily from Latino ethnocentrists. In Europe, it comes from Muslims.
The commonality between the two situations is that the predominate interlopers come from places and traditions with which the West has no history of ever being able to reasonably enculture. History makes me suspect that in the case of some peoples the process of Westernization or Americanization simply cannot ever occur. This, perhaps, may be due to some built-in, too-deeply-rooted, culturally artifactual “antibodies” that force a rejection of the host. If this is so, the best we can hope for is uneasy co-existence, but it would mean that our cultures would forever be forced to have anti-rejection measures (and laws) in place.
Based upon what we are seeing both here and in Europe, the various cultural and actual costs of allowing certain Diasporas to co-exist doesn’t seem to be a reasonable exchange worthy of long-term investment.
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